Lex Fridman Podcast

Snapshot · Lex Fridman Podcast

#482 – Pavel Durov: Telegram, Freedom, Censorship, Money, Power & Human Nature

Explore episode Oct 1, 2025

Where this was said

Edward Snowden

At 3:00:16 · chapter starts 2:57:48

Durov's assessment of Snowden is unambiguous: what he did was brave, important, and revealing. The most significant lesson, in Durov's telling, was that people who appeared to be independent security and cryptography experts were actually connected to the NSA, promoting encryption standards with deliberate flaws that gave intelligence agencies backdoor access. The second lesson was that government, given the opportunity, always overreaches: 9/11 created a genuine need for a security response, but the response expanded far beyond what was justified, eroding the right to privacy on a massive scale. Asked which intelligence agencies he fears most, Durov gives a characteristically philosophical answer: they all can probably kill him one way or another, so the question reduces back to whether he fears death. The answer, as established at the beginning of the conversation, is no — or at least, he has trained himself to overcome that fear. He keeps in occasional contact with Snowden but has never met him in person and hopes to change that someday.

Technology
Russia's 2018 Telegram Ban and the Digital Resistance

#482 – Pavel Durov: Telegram, Freedom, Censorship, Money, P… · Oct 1, 2025 Technology

Russia demanded Telegram's encryption keys in 2017-18. When Telegram refused, Russia banned the app — and Telegram fought back with a 'Digital Resistance' campaign, burning through millions of IP addresses to stay online. The blowback: Russian banks and social networks went offline as collateral damage from the censor's own blocks.

Similar snapshots