Lex Fridman Podcast

Snapshot · Lex Fridman Podcast

#482 – Pavel Durov: Telegram, Freedom, Censorship, Money, Power & Human Nature

Explore episode Oct 1, 2025

Where this was said

Iran and Russia government pressure

At 3:02:00 · chapter starts 3:01:33

The 2018 bans were the first major test of Telegram's technical and political resilience. In Iran, where Telegram had become the organizing platform for anti-government protests, the ban was total — but Telegram's response was creative rather than purely technical: it created an economic incentive system for Iranians to operate their own proxy servers, monetizable by displaying ads to connected users, which essentially crowdsourced the bypass infrastructure. Today approximately 50 million Iranians still access Telegram despite the ongoing ban. Russia's situation was more dramatic. The government demanded encryption keys — which Telegram told them don't exist in the form they imagined — and then attempted a broad IP-blocking campaign when Telegram refused. Telegram responded with an automated system that rotated through millions of IP addresses faster than they could be blocked, supported by a global community of volunteer system administrators setting up proxy servers as part of the 'Digital Resistance' movement. The Russian censors, in their attempt to block Telegram, ended up blocking so many IP subnets that Russian banks, supermarkets, and domestic social networks also went offline as collateral damage. The most concerning development during this period was Apple's behavior: the company refused to update Telegram in the App Store for more than a month, effectively forcing old, breaking versions on users worldwide. A New York Times story quoting Durov's criticism of Apple, accompanied by photos of Moscow protesters flying paper airplanes in solidarity with Telegram, eventually prompted Apple to reverse course — with fifteen minutes to spare before Durov was about to abandon the Russian market entirely.

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