The a16z Show

Podbit · The a16z Show

Ben Horowitz and Travis Kalanick on Building Again

Explore episode Aug 14, 2026

Where this was said

Q&A: Who Is the Final Boss for Atoms?

At 28:20 · chapter starts 27:40

A brief but high-energy exchange about competitive framing in industrial AI. Kalanick acknowledges the obvious: if anyone represents the ceiling of ambition in multi-industry physical automation, it's Elon Musk. He cloaks the name in a jokey rhyme — 'rhymes with Shmilan' — but the respect is unmistakable. He positions himself as the 'baby goat' in the space, someone with enormous ambition who has a long way to go before earning comparison to the leader. The exchange also signals that Kalanick is entering a competitive landscape where the final boss is not a traditional industrial company but another tech visionary with far more resources.

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